This video has eveything
Here's the too long didn't watch
>Owen Benjamin banned from Patreon
>fans are cult-like so they don't like this
>begin reading Patreon ToS
>realize that under their ToS they have an agreement with the creator and not Patreon
>this is so Patreon doesn't get sued if someone doesn't deliver on a promise
>the leaves the legal question of whether or not is Patreon engaging in tortuous interference (fucking with a contract they aren't a party to) by banning Owen Benjamin
>find out they can't bring Patreon to court, but only to arbitration as per their ToS
>also can't bring class actions
>instead they each bring an individual arbitration claim which costs like 200 dollars each
>Patreon is now faced with 80 separate arbitration claims all on the same issue
>Patreon has to foot any extra costs past that 200 all by themselves
>this could run in the tens to hundreds of thousands of dollars for each claim
>realize their fucked
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Patreon catch 80 separate arbitration claimsundoReturn
Anonymous 07/30/20(Thu)20:47:14 No. [R]
This video has eveything
Anonymous 07/30/20(Thu)20:48:49 No. [R]
>change their ToS to prevent arbitration claims by Patrons
>counter sue all the fans starting arbitrations to get an injunction put against their proceeding
>judge says lol nope
Patreon may now go bankrupt over this.
well, well, welll >8]
Anonymous 07/30/20(Thu)21:22:41 No. [R]
Anonymous 07/30/20(Thu)21:21:20 No. [R]
Anonymous 07/30/20(Thu)21:49:23 No. [R]
Every day the chance of this site outliving patreon grows
Anonymous 07/30/20(Thu)23:12:45 No. [R]
Patreon is fucked, but serves them right for going woke.
Long live SubscribeStar
Anonymous 07/31/20(Fri)00:31:44 No. [R]
Bring back free fucking art, like it used to be before these paysites came and turned 70% of online artists into greed fuelled sellouts. Patreon may go under, but it doesn't seem to matter when theres atleast 2 other well known paysites people can immediately jump ship to; that is, assuming they aren't a!ready on all of these paysites simultaneously, taking in 4 different sets of money, and for what, just "so we can keep drawing because drawing isn't free even though it always was before".
I wish this felt like it was actually gonna make a difference...
Anonymous 07/31/20(Fri)01:19:12 No. [R]
yeeeesssssssssss please, for the love of god have patreon go under.
Anonymous 07/31/20(Fri)02:32:47 No. [R]
I would also prefer if the art we find here was instead posted for free, but honestly, the only reason I think so much of the old stuff was free is because people didn't think there was a market for it, so only the ones that didn't care about making art for free did it, unless the community goes under somehow I don't believe things are ever going to change, good thing we have this site and u18
Anonymous 07/31/20(Fri)05:25:28 No. [R]
The way I see it, most artists are using paysites as a way to have basic income and support themselves, so that they can keep drawing instead of getting a "real job" that would leave them with less time to draw, and thus less art to publish.
IMO, the ones who actually use this money to pay for food, rent, bills, computer upgrades, etc. and actually deliver their promises are cool.
Even cooler if they don't completely paywall everything, as in eventually publicly releasing the art a short while later. Perhaps they'll have some incentive to get people to donate to them, like having HD versions, PSDs, or alternate versions. And that's fine.
But then you have the scumbags who only have things behind a paywall, or the only things they DO release to public are horribly downscaled, censored, or cropped versions. Fuck those guys in particular.
Anonymous 07/31/20(Fri)10:16:47 No. [R]
Absolutely this, damn. It hurts so much seeing the occasional new post from one of my favorite artists on pixiv, and then it's basically just a cropped/zoomed "please subscribe to fanbox thx" ad, like everything they've published for the past 2 years.
Sure, it's nice being able to support content creators you enjoy, but I feel like Patreon and the likes caused way too big of a mentality change in some of them. I miss the old internet so much.
Anonymous 07/31/20(Fri)14:08:37 No. [R]
understand a simple thing: the period when artists painted something for free and unselfishly for any of the artists did not last long. Either he drew 1-2 characters a month maximum ... or, increasing his skills, he got a job that took all his time and energy. Artists who are ready to work full time on content must pay their bills, computer upgrades, etc. This is the only way they can create many pictures.
If drawing doesn't give them income, they just waste their time on other work. And the pictures are getting much smaller.
After all, after work (especially if it is associated with drawing), artists have very little time and energy, and most importantly, the motivation to do their work for free a little longer. There are many interesting films, computer games and other entertainment around. Why did you decide that artists are constantly experiencing craving only for drawing and simply cannot fall asleep until they please you with another picture? Thanks to this place and many others, where artists can see all your concentrated egoism, greed and hatred towards them - they are less and less likely to experience illusions about such "fans". And as the artist begins to see, he is less willing to spend his time on your kind.
There are a million other activities around besides drawing. Movies, cartoons, hiking, computer games. Do you really believe that drawing is more interesting for artists than all other forms of entertainment and even if it doesn't give them any motivation, will they continue to do it?
Of course - NO.
Especially when they see comments from people like you here. All this is your whining, greed, laziness (and as a result - poverty), the concentration of hatred for those who have learned to defend themselves from you.
All this will only nudge young artists to take advantage of DRM and advice from seniors. And the more hatred towards artists such places generate, the more hatred you will receive in response. No more.
Anonymous 07/31/20(Fri)14:10:58 No. [R]
Long before the advent of the Internet, there was a catch phrase - hatred breeds hatred. Only her. Even if suddenly regular leaks destroy the artist's hopes of making money from his talent, he will not repent, he will not declare "yes, I do not need money ... I will live on the street and work for free." He will simply quit painting, having lost his motivation. And he will go to another job in which no one can steal his work. Make some stupid mobile games that milk all the money out of very primitive people. If I were you, I would pray that DRM will live long and allow artists to make money. In this case, you can at least enjoy "demo versions" of their pictures, just as homeless people can get expired products for free. This is the world, accept it.
Anonymous 07/31/20(Fri)15:12:35 No. [R]
we'll be alright. Patreon dies, everyone moves to subscribestar, all the admin has to do is code another importer, which doesn't require effort or imagination.
Anonymous 07/31/20(Fri)15:48:49 No. [R]
Oh shit oh fuck there's some creators on there I haven't got the chance to pledge and take the content..
Do you guys think Patreon content will be archived down the line if it indeed goes down?
Anonymous 07/31/20(Fri)16:37:31 No. [R]
Only someone who works at patreon can say for sure, but I do think they will go down without archiving anything.
Anonymous 07/31/20(Fri)16:48:36 No. [R]
Anonymous 07/31/20(Fri)18:53:00 No. [R]
I do think you are right on the "artists leave if no money " part unfortunately, a lot artist have popped up over the years which don't seem to have any connection with the community or background in other sites, some of them make great content, but I strongly believe that this kind of creator would be the first to quit if the market for art dwindled. However patreon alone doesn't control all the market, sites like subscribe star and onlyfans follow a similar model, and could very well serve as a replacement to patreon if it does go down
Anonymous 07/31/20(Fri)19:56:34 No. [R]
nonsense. there are already 5 platforms ready to replace Patreon. Much more friendly and adequate. Without moronic censorship and whims. The artists will just go there. Many have already left. On Subscribestar for example.
Anonymous 08/01/20(Sat)17:10:05 No. [R]
Anna 08/01/20(Sat)17:36:17 No. [R]
Don't act like artists are some great professionals who need to earn money. I have seen some of the art and most are not worth the dollar sign. Where is this indignation when artists sell trademark characters or earn money from merchandise, Somehow you care when its patreon artists getting ripped off but not when they rip off other companies or professionals. Artists want to stop, fine, others will either come or the interest dies.
Anonymous 08/01/20(Sat)19:05:44 No. [R]
well great - then why are you sitting here screaming for someone to pay and steal it for you? Imagine that all of them simply do not exist. blacklist everyone who mentions patreon and you will see a real number of artists who are ready to work for free for you.
I think any of the top 100 artists could easily make a lot more. if I didn't draw furry, but something for mobile games in the office. A lot more. It is sad that most of the inhabitants here are too backward to appreciate the attempts of artists to make furry content. Well - capitalism and the market = the strongest and the most toothy will survive. Small and weak will surrender to circumstances.
Anonymous 08/01/20(Sat)21:37:27 No. [R]
>if I didn't draw furry
After watching the furry fandom basically implode upon itself with the advent of this pay-per-view/artificial scarcity bullshit for internet art, was the day I declared myself an ex-furry because I just knew it was going to mutate into the disaster it is today. And I have seen some heavy-duty shit being part of the fandom for nearly 18 years. In fact, the only two reasons I come around here from time-to-time is to have a good laugh at the creatorfags pissing and shitting their collective diapers over the very existence of this site (because paying welfare to an artist, unquestionably is totally justified) and it proves my point to the nines that really isn't a damn thing behind any of these paywalls worth a single fuck to view. Perhaps it may never happen again, but stick to the tried-and-true method of selling commissions and physical copies of artwork because that shows a real motherfucking effort worth paying a good amount of money for.
In short, if this fandom were to die tomorrow I would not shed a single tear because hey, I'm not gonna cry because its over but smile 'cause it happened. 🤣
Anonymous 08/01/20(Sat)22:31:06 No. [R]
"Fake motivation" is a perfect way of putting it, but having the art not exist is maybe too far for me, I'd rather the artists went back to earning money the honest/fair way, as in by commissions, requests, work contracts etc. I was making tissue companies rich years before Patreon existed, and back then, I never was expected to pay for a single piece of smut (or non smut) unless it was made to my specifications (EG: Draw me Lara Croft getting fucked by Mario while Raiden electrically stimulates Chun-Li and a Xenomorph is filming the whole thing, and Pinhead from Hellraiser is a good guy now, a porn director). Thats when I'm happy to support an artist.
Anonymous 08/01/20(Sat)22:42:20 No. [R]
Anonymous 08/01/20(Sat)23:12:31 No. [R]
I don't think thats true. For example, before Patreon and the recent culture of "pay per view art" was born, there were still oceans worth of artists, some making no money, others making P's from comms, contracts etc. Some low skilled beginners, some intermediates, some insanely skilled. When "paysite art" became "the new way", I don't think it ushered in a huge new demographic of artists who didn't exist before, its more that artists who were drawing since years back turned "Jewish" (I'm not anti-semetic, its just an age old "greed joke"), and the amount of new artists that started drawing since that time, is probably comparitively small (artists who were "born into the Patreon era" Vs artists born before) since its only around 10 years since Patreon started IIRC, and online artists have likely been posting since the internet was capable of storing images.
Artists who've been corrupted by money above all may well stop drawing because they're not drawing for a love of drawing anymore. Artists who've always drawn for the love of drawing, will still keep drawing because when you love drawing, you simply "want to draw anyway" whether getting paid for it or not.
Anonymous 08/01/20(Sat)23:18:07 No. [R]
>It hurts so much seeing the occasional new post from one of my favorite artists on pixiv, and then it's basically just a cropped/zoomed "please subscribe to fanbox thx"
>I feel like Patreon and the likes caused way too big of a mentality change in some of them. I miss the old internet so much
Its very aggravating. Aggravating nostalgia ;(
Anonymous 08/02/20(Sun)04:19:17 No. [R]
fair and honest is not profitable.
commissioners can also be miserly skinflints that make pre-spook Scrooge look like a philantropist, who want their smut fast, cheap and good.
Anonymous 08/02/20(Sun)07:11:29 No. [R]
But if you do not be hypocritical, then you will notice that this is usually much less common than when the artist considers it not a hobby, but work. And certainly there would be fewer different comics - fewer plots and more commissions, the consistency of which is mainly interesting to the customer. Artists develop other hobbies and interests. It happens. few people remain faithful to their hobby for a long time. This is mostly a very irregular activity.
In addition, artists who have achieved a good level of drawing would easily find office work using their skill. At the same time, no matter how much you love your hobby, if you have been drawing something uninteresting all day ... continuing to draw something interesting in the evening is probably not so easy as it might seem to those who have never watched the artist's stream and do not understand how many hours of time the artist invests into the picture. All this could be understood if we were a little less hypocritical.
> commissioners can also be miserly skinflints that make pre-spook Scrooge look like a philantropist, who want their smut fast, cheap and good.
Yes, while in 90% of cases it has no plot and meaning. All the poses are endlessly repeated, and over the past 15 years those who have long been in this topic have seen all these poses. Yes, even good porn can get bored for 15 years.
Anonymous 08/02/20(Sun)10:52:33 No. [R]
>well great - then why are you sitting here screaming for someone to pay and steal it for you?
Question is argumentative: Where's this screaming you're talking about, and what's there to steal?
Anonymous 08/03/20(Mon)02:12:57 No. [R]
In my experience, artists often do not create more art than they did before Patreon. Most of them use it to live a life of leisure (Zone, for instance, just plays VRChat and shitposts on Twitter all day). They do quit their jobs, yes, but they do not use that extra time to actually work on art.
I hope Patreon dies. Things were better before it existed.